!!!! I cannot believe that, in my drunken state, I thought “15 sounds like a well-rounded place to stop for the day. Let’s stop there!” WHAT WAS I THINKING.
You guys all know the drill: we’re discussing the first fifteen chapters of Mockingjay right now. ONLY the first 15 chapters! If you’ve finished the book, either keep it in your pants or go find Chapter 15 and hijack all memory of what happens after it. STOP HINTING IN THE COMMENTS.
Seriously. Stop it. I have already been spoiled twice by comments to our previous posts. WE WILL DELETE ANY SPOILERY COMMENTS. If you can’t keep it in your pants, don’t comment at all.
I echo Henri:
HOLYSHITHOLYSHITHOLYSHIT.
Okay, let’s pause before we talk about The Nut, Gale and revenge, Peeta and hijacking, Finnick and his awesomeness, and let’s focus for a bit on the things that make me undeniably happy, without any reservations:
Prim (and Buttercup)
How fucking awesome is it that Prim has come into her own? We got hints of it, of course, in Catching Fire, but now that she’s been given more of a voice, I just love her. Prim! I always wanted you to be awesome! And now you are! But next time, PLEASE rescue the cat BEFORE the doors lock on the shutdown, mkay?
And, as a person who abides by the will of my own very fat cat, I love that Buttercup has united the people of District 13. Win or lose this war, I have a feeling that a lot of people are about to become cat people in that District.
Boggs
Suzanne Collins always manages to introduce at least one character in her books that makes me wish I could go back in time and have that character around in the book before the one I’m reading (if that makes sense). And this time, it’s Boggs. OH BOGGS, I LOVE YOU SO MUCH. I just love his little sighs anytime Katniss does something that he knows will probably get him killed.
Finnick
Finnick, Finnick, Finnick. I love you so much. I want you to endlessly parade around in your underwear, tying and untying your knots.
How heartbreaking – and for me, completely shocking – was the reveal that Finnick, and many other Victors, were sold as sex slaves by President Snow? I mean, I don’t know why I was so shocked – it’s not like President Snow is known for his philanthropic work, but WHAT. That made me so angry and sad on Finnick’s behalf that I started doing some sort of scream-crying and I had to put the book down for a few minutes. Apparently, my tolerance is high when it comes to dropping tracker jackers on people, or whipping people in the public square for hunting turkeys, or mine explosions, but my limits are reached when it comes to child prostitution. Well, it’s always good to know one’s boundaries.
Okay, moving on. Let’s talk about Gale for a minute. I can’t believe I’m about to say this, but . . . Suzanne Collins, I do not agree with your choices in life.
The one thing I hate in romantic triangles – actually, I hate romantic triangles, full stop; stop bogarting all the available men/women, protagonist! – is when the writer deus ex assholica one of the romantic interests, i.e. when a character who previously was portrayed as good turns out to be a pedophile or something, nottonameanynamesJacob. And I feel like that’s going on, somewhat, with Gale, and that is WEAK SAUCE. I want Peeta to win Katniss’s heart because Peeta is the best! Not because Gale is the worst!
But, beyond the romantic implications, I have to say that I kind of like what’s happening to Gale. In a way. I would not want to be friends with the guy right now, but I do think it’s interesting, on a character level, the change he’s undergoing. We always knew that Gale had a hard streak, just as Katniss has. But whereas Katniss tends to resort to manipulation or grief when her hard streak is tested – taking care of Peeta in the Games, covering Rue with flowers, etc – Gale has gone the other way and turned cold. His takedown of The Nut was, frankly, brilliant military strategy. And it was probably the right thing to do in order to secure District Two. But, man, it is not likely to get him invited over for dinner anytime soon.
I feel in some ways that Gale’s now replaced his need/desire for Katniss with a need/desire for vengeance and bloodshed. If only Madge were around to knock some sense into him!!
And, last, but certainly not least: Team Peeta
I’ll disagree with Henri (shocker); I think the hijacking was a brilliant move on Collins’ part. She had a few different options, I suppose: having Peeta tortured and come back broken and in need of Katniss to nurse him gently back to health, etc. But I’ve seen The English Patient; it blew, and I’m not interested in revisiting it in book form. And, of course, having Peeta hate Katniss is actually pretty freaking great. Because I love Katniss and all, but she’s: selfish, short-sighted, hotheaded and manipulative (and this is what makes her amazing). The fact that Peeta is going to have to work from scratch – if he chooses to do so – in order to not want to actively kill her is kind of awesome.
I also disagree that it’s a “Romantic Stalker” trope, because lord knows, I hate that shit. (Eat it, Lloyd Dobbler.) But I do think it’s very much a “Reform the Bad Boy” trope, which is almost as annoying. Unfortunately, unlike the idea that women should fall for abusive stalkers, I have to admit that at least I have been suckered into the “Reform the Bad Boy” relationship many a time. “Ooh, look at that guy. He’s rude, and he hates me, and he treats everyone like shit,” I think. “I can fix him.”
It remains to be seen whether Peeta can be fixed, or whether Katniss will even want to try. And, if she does try to win Peeta’s good graces again, I wonder what her motivation will be. Out of love? Or out of a selfish desire to be loved?
Some questions I still have: when was Cinna drafted to the cause? Before the first Games? After? Before the Quarter Quell was announced? After? He seems to have had a lot of time on his hands to design all these outfits.
Some questions we got answered: Why President Snow smells of blood. Awesome.
That’s it for this round, folks. Check in tomorrow, as Henri and I will be discussing THE ENTIRE BOOK. Oh my god, KATNISS BETTER BE OKAY.
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{ 33 comments… read them below or add one }
My heart dropped when I read that part about Finnick. He’s definitely my Mockingjay favorite.
I posted this on Henri’s post, but I will say it again:
I was upset about the hijacking, but in some ways, I thought it was brilliant. In CATCHING FIRE, the assumption Katniss (and we as readers) made was that she was safe from going back into the arena. NOT SO! What Collins does is brilliant–in putting Katniss back in the Games, she shows that NOTHING IS SAFE and demonstrates the real despicable nature of the Capitol.
In MOCKINGJAY, the absolute one thing that Katniss (and Haymitch and the readers) took for granted was Peeta’s love for her. It was incorruptible. NOT SO. What a brilliant move on Collins’ part. The one thing you thought safe is not. I also like that we’ve seen Katniss grow to care for Peeta over the course of the books (as opposed to her affection for Gale, which has been taken for granted by both Gale and us) and now SHE HAS TO EARN HIS BACK. And at this point, she’s going to CHOOSE to earn it back.
(I don’t think Suzanne Collins is showing or changing Gale’s character to make him less appealing. I actually think his character development rings true. It’s very realistic. It doesn’t make him a bad person–it makes him a REAL person. It’s not character assassination, not like Lupin in J.K. Rowling’s DEATHLY HALLOWS. I’m still not over that.)
I’ve heard several people complain about character assassination with Lupin and I have always been wanting to know what exactly to what people are referring to in the books. Do you mind explaining?
porcelinajune-
I haven’t heard people talk about it before, but I can only assume it’s the moment in the book where we found out Lupin wanted to ditch his pregnant wife and got into an argument with Harry and punched him in the face. That part made me soooo mad, I’m glad to see I’m not the only one.
There’s lots I want to say, but it’s colored by what happens later, so I’ll shut up for now.
BUT! BUT! BUT! I was horrified that Finnick and other hotttt victors were forced into prostitution. But because I know Finnick as an adult, I totally didn’t put together the fact that this started as child prostitution.
I liked Catching Fire more than Hunger Games, because the psychological cruelty of how the Capitol treats people was more interesting and gut-wrenching than their weird creatures and traps. And this just tops everything. (Why does it top it more than actually killing kids for sport? I have no idea, it just does.)
I agree with JJ – I don’t think Collins is deliberately changing Gale into someone else – I think he’s always sort of been hard and anti-Capitolist and rebellious. It’s just, we see the story from only Katniss’ perspective and she can be totally clueless and unobservant sometimes. We get glimpses of Gale’s rebel leanings, but now that the rebellion is out in the open, it’s so much more obvious. I would also imagine that he’s had more time to drink the District 13 kool-aid, whereas Katniss seems to be in the hospital the whole time.
I don’t know if I buy the hijacking as “reform the bad boy” – I saw it more as extreme PTSD, part of the whole “war is bad” metaphor. Peeta’s been tortured and now he has to figure out how to deal with or “fix” that while Katniss has to figure out how to love someone who’s not the same person.
skimming this post because I am still waiting for my copy to be delivered! UPS….. so slow when you are waiting for an awesoem book!
I set up a linky today for people to link any Mockingjay related posts so please feel free to do so if you would like
“She had a few different options, I suppose: having Peeta tortured and come back broken and in need of Katniss to nurse him gently back to health, etc. But I’ve seen The English Patient; it blew, and I’m not interested in revisiting it in book form.”
When you put it that way, you’re right. Hijacking Peeta’s head is definitely the lesser of two evils, plot wise. I also agree with you that I don’t want Katniss to go with Peeta because HE is the lesser of two evils. I don’t want Katniss to with Peeta at all, but especially not because apparently out of all the guys in Panem, she can only end up with Peeta or Gale and she and Gale are not seeing eye to eye on stuff. Ugh.
Why can’t she win the revolution and find a new guy who didn’t know her AT ALL before the games and build a whole new life with him? I know that breaks all of the love triangle rules, but I don’t buy the argument that Peeta is the only person that can understand her because they went through the Games OR that Gale is the right choice because they’ve known each other since they were young. Both of those arguments are bad reasons to spend the rest of your life with someone! If Katniss has no options outside of the two of them, then one of them needs to let go of their infatuation (or fabricated hatred) for the Katniss they knew a couple years ago and fall in love with the Katniss standing right in front of them. I hope it’s Gale.
I have to say, I would HATE it if Katniss ended up with RandomNewGuy…yes, it’s more realistic perhaps, but it would also result in a seriously unsatisfactory ending. We’ve grown to love both Peeta and Gale throughout the course of the series, and one of the great pleasures of novels is that sense of resolution after the dramatic questions are answered. And definitely, one of the dramatic questions that Suzanne Collins presents throughout the series is “Does Katniss’s heart truly belong to Peeta or Gale?” For the answer to be, “I choose ME” (tm Kelly Taylor) would be tremendously unsatisfying, from a narrative sense.
Even though I posted a whole scenario with random new guy, I totally agree with you. I’m just sick of Katniss being in love with the boy with the bread and the guy in the meadow and for Peeta and Gale to be in love with pictures of her that they have in their own heads (I’m pretending Peeta does not have that whole memory problem for this argument, which I know is cheating). Collins just keeps returning to Katniss and Gale being more happy together when they’re hunting than any other time, and Katniss getting all gooey when she thinks about that incident with Peeta and the bread from before they’d even spoken (and that kiss on the beach in Catching Fire). She can’t go back to those experiences with either of them! There’s been character development since then! Why can’t any of the three of them recognize that in the other?!? Katniss could love Gale for being a brilliant strategist or hate him for being a heartless jerk. He could love her for being the face of the revolution or hate her for “going soft” on people who went along with the capital. And I would be fine with any of those scenarios, even though I want more than anything for them to end up together in the end.
And there I stop because I feel like the rest of my thought behind this (including most of the Peeta half of it) goes beyond chapter 15.
I read the tag “TEABS” as “TEARS.” This is very appropriate for many of the things you mention. My jaw dropped when I hit the part about Finnick’s past.
Also, why must poor Boggs be such a butt monkey? When Katniss puked on him and Gale broke his nose I was like “C’mon, Suzanne Collins, leave this poor bastard alone, you’re gonna make me cry here.”
Love love love your Mockingjay opinions. I was wondering the same things most of the time, especially about Gale. But after considering Ch. 1-15 after-the-fact, I have to agree with Meredith & JJ that it was a natural character shift.
Boggs and Finnick FTW, totally. And I LOVE Prim in this book!
I can’t wait for tomorrow to see your thoughts on the rest of the book!!! So many things to discuss!
IA that the hijacking was brilliant. It pulled the rug out from Katniss and crew but also the reader. The whole time before we saw the change, we were worried about what tortures they were visiting on Peeta, but I never imagined that one of the tortures would be to destroy Peeta’s love for Katniss. I see it as less of a “reforming the bad boy” trope (because Peeta WASN’T a bad boy–he was altered by the Capital) and more as a “Capital has the power to destroy EVERYTHING” moment. Which, of course, makes them an even more worthy and terrifying adversary.
Also, I don’t agree that Gale is being ruined in order to clear the road for Peeta and Katniss. He’s older, has more memory of his sufferings at the hand of the Capital (we have to remember that while Katniss gave herself, he had to stay home and WATCH her in those horrible games). He’s also always been shown as a more violent, vengeful character.
Oh MAN. Quite literally the only thing I have been able to do today is continually read the posts and comments here and obsess over Mockingjay. I should have taken the whole week off.
I’m of the opinion that while the harder edge to Gale isn’t totally out of character, and it seems a natural shift, there are a handful of things that he does that just seem kind of.. off to me. BUT I LURVE HIM SO MOSHE
Also totally adore Boggs – that sigh just says it right there!
Does anyone else love Chapter 7 as much as I do and want to have its babies?
And JJ – YES TO EVERYTHING YOU SAID (up to and including Lupin, WTH was that?!?!?) – I think the hijacking is brilliant – it’s like all the times I wanted Peeta to stand up for himself to Katniss and not be a wimp are being made up for and I DON’T LIKE IT!
I know I’m practically the conductor of the Team Gale Bandwagon but that doesn’t mean I don’t love our Peeta. It’s so tragic the way they’ve twisted him, it breaks my heart.
I suppose I should try not to get fired sometime today, huh?
Aaaand I forgot to subscribe to comments so here I am again.
So much for being functional at my job.
I’ve given up on functionality for the day, for the most part. How often do you get to dissect a book like this? Outside of an English class of course.
SO glad I’m not alone. Also you and I seem to be twinsies when it comes to how we feel about Gale/Peeta/Katniss. More than once while reading your thoughts, I’ve said “PREACH, girlfriend!” which has not earned me popularity among my coworkers.
I loved Boggs, too! He was just all kinds of world-weary awesome.
I’m not sure what I think about Gale at this point, but it’s…not trending well?…and that makes me sad, because, love triangle or not, I liked him for who he was back in District 12. Or maybe who he seemed to be.
Am I the only one who goes around humming the theme song for MST3K during the district 13 songs?
“In the not-too-distant future
Way down in Deep 13…”
(Okay, probably that’s just me.)
Rebel roll call!
Boggs! Castor! Pollux!
Cooooooooooin!
I always liked Gale (not as much as Peeta, but still), so I was DEEPLY shocked and saddened by his choice to blow up the Nut. I agree, Erin, it was out of nowhere!! I expect Gale to be cavalier with Capitol lives (I don’t like it, but I expect it), but to do that to a FELLOW DISTRICT?
I don’t give a crap whether they’re cozy with the Capitol, Gale. Their kids get shipped off to the Arena too!! So stop being an asshole and get it together!!
Man. Objectively, Gale is a wonderful character (angry, passionate and complex–it’s like my trifecta) but I won’t be giving him my bff charm anytime soon
The bit when everyone broke down sobbing on camera was basically around the point when I broke down in real life – and then from then on it was pretty hard to stop me. Blame it on lack of sleep – I don’t care – that was some powerful shizz.
And I agree that the hijacking was a little bit genius – and it’s just so heartbreaking, because Peeta was/is(?) *such* a wonderful, good boy. But I like that it made Katniss reevaluate herself.
Never watch Phineus and Ferb while reading that book. I cannot think of Boggs as anyone but Major Monogram.
OMG chapter 15 was a CRUEL CRUEL stopping point!! I think I almost stopped breathing from anxiety.
I LOVE Boggs and Prim. It’s so nice to see katniss opening up to people too instead of bottling everything up inside like she did in CF. Even if one of those people is occasionally Dickwad Gale. She is slowly removing herself from that fishbowl she kept herself in and is really seeing the big picture.
I was never on Team Gale. And now I know why!! 99% of his lines make me want to slap him. His comment about her kissing him only because he was in pain and then walking away was so manipulative. His attitude toward her was just so coarse and harsh especially considering he supposedly loved her. I just don’t think he understands her or if he does doesn’t care/respect her as she is.
And the reveal about the victors being sex slaves broke my heart. I was not expecting that AT ALL! And when Katniss finally broke down and cried out for Haymitch (of all, he really was the only one who could) to comfort her I literally started crying. Again….was not expecting that! Good job Suzanne, you keep surprising me!
Now onto chapter 16 and the chaos I’m sure is about to reign. Talk about the shizz hitting the fan!!
OH MY GOD. erin, i TOTES agree with you on the child prostitution (FINNICK!! oh, poor finnick. i want to sic benson and stabler on prez snow now) and on boggs and prim. i love boggs so so so so much! and hate gale just THAT much more for kicking him in the face. and for being a sycophantic, hate-filled asshole, even if it IS realistic character development. cos i gotta agree with meredith and JJ there.
it was SO hard to stop reading at the end of 15, but i am COMMITTED to a spoiler-free existence here, folks. but now i am off to chapter 16.
something important:
it just occurred to me that peeta + katniss = pee-niss. they are destined to be together!
I think I am in the minority here but I’ve read up to chp. 17 so far and I can honestly say I don’t think I like the book. I’m hoping something will happen to change my mind in the last few pages. I can’t quite put my finger on it but maybe I just don’t like change lol.
I’m so in love with Finnick though! I too broke down when he was recounting his story. My heart just went out to him.
I can’t wait to hear what you think of the book when you’ve finished! Please, please let us know your final thoughts!
Will do! I am hoping to finish tonight. I actually cheated and read the last page but it doesn’t help with my anxiety of how this is going to turn out!
I read this post first before I read Henri’s and I think he summed up best why I am not digging the book so far.
Yeah, I thought the hijacking was interesting, as well, not because it’s an easy way to get Katniss to fall for him (although, well, yes) but because Peeta worshipping Katniss in the face of her very real selfishness and disregard for his feelings DROVE ME FUCKING CRAZY. So although I didn’t want him to, you know, choke the life out of her, it is nice for someone to tell Katniss that she’s a real piece of work, because SHE IS.
Wow. It seems your opinion on Mockingjay is similar to mine. I’m heartbroken that Prim and Finnick died. And Boggs. So many awesome characters dead, Peeta’s hijacked, and poor Gale and Katniss are both stumbling around confused about their… in other words, SUZANNE COLLIN’S A GENIUS! Well, I’m not happy about all those characters dying, but the hijacking was just…. amazing. Loved the book. And the series.
Can someone please tell me if Gale was a hooker or not?! Cause my friend said that they hintied it in the book. But I can not find anything. Please Please Please tell me!
Hi Elena,
Your friend was a bit confused – Finnick, not Gale, was forced into prostitution by President Snow upon winning his games.
Since this is almost four months later (approximately two centuries in Internet time), I realize that few people will hear this, but I REALLY need to share. Did no one else recognize the whole hijacking plot from another book? It was more or less identical to what happens to the love interest in The Obernewtyn Chronicles by Isobelle Carmody- capture by post-apocalyptic enemy government, chemical/psychological torture, and conditioning to destroy love of heroine (also her life, if he gets close enough)- sound familiar? I love SCollins and all, but that was like cold water in the face.